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Old 05-15-2007, 02:02 AM   #73
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A lot of these questions where brought up in the original GB thread when we all signed up for these pulleys. The vibration damper in the stock pulley is a think rubber band that hardly does much. After talking with Mike of NST on his screen name (NSTonAIM) it sounds like NST is capable of building pulleys with these rubber pieces in them, but the costs would be 3 times what they are now. The rubber is very over rated and NST has removed it in 99% of the cars they build pulleys for. The rubber has not proven to be a necessary component of the pulley in all their testing and the testimonial of thousands of aftermarket pulley users for the past 15 years or so.

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Old 05-15-2007, 04:30 AM   #74
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Adding a vibration dampner to the NST would probably double its price...
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Originally Posted by YarisGuy View Post
NST is capable of building pulleys with these rubber pieces in them, but the costs would be 3 times what they are now.
I don't mind having a bit more vibration in the car, especially with the obvious advantages that a crank pulley brings to the table. I guess I just don't understand why a rubber band would increase prices so dramatically.
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Old 05-15-2007, 05:36 AM   #75
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I don't mind having a bit more vibration in the car, especially with the obvious advantages that a crank pulley brings to the table. I guess I just don't understand why a rubber band would increase prices so dramatically.

Well, I would guess a pulley is being made in a two step process (CNC mill, then anodize), but if you want a rubber insert, it would be made in a lot more steps, as two pieces of aluminium need to be made, then a piece of rubber needs to be made, and sandwiched between the aluminium. All these extra steps would need more time, and a lot more labor, and as a result, a lot more money
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Old 05-15-2007, 05:55 AM   #76
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Well, I would guess a pulley is being made in a two step process (CNC mill, then anodize), but if you want a rubber insert, it would be made in a lot more steps, as two pieces of aluminium need to be made, then a piece of rubber needs to be made, and sandwiched between the aluminium. All these extra steps would need more time, and a lot more labor, and as a result, a lot more money
Thanks for the explanation. I just thought it was a rubber ring we were talking about here. Seems to be more like an aluminum hoagie now.

Great. Now I've got the munchies.
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Old 05-17-2007, 04:07 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by eTiMaGo View Post
Well, I would guess a pulley is being made in a two step process (CNC mill, then anodize), but if you want a rubber insert, it would be made in a lot more steps, as two pieces of aluminium need to be made, then a piece of rubber needs to be made, and sandwiched between the aluminium. All these extra steps would need more time, and a lot more labor, and as a result, a lot more money
Thanks eTiMaGo, you pretty much nailed that one on the head.

Furthermore on the topic of the rubber damper, engine vibrations, or possible threats resulting from elimination of this rubber piece...

On a relatively understressed near stock motor with bolt ons or low amounts of boost like what most of the people on this forum probably run, a solid pulley will not have any life threatening consiquences. The factory pulley with a 2mm (less than a 1/8th inch) damper is primarily there for wide band NVH (noise vibration harshness) supression from the engine and driveline. Removing the damper and replacing it with a solid pulley will lead to minor addtional NVH but will not harm the engine. In fact, most people claim their engines seem to run smoother with NST pulleys.

The engineering reasons are that most modern engines have a short, strong crank with, a relatively high natural frequency. The dangerous second harmonic that can cause damage occurs at an rpm that this sort of engine will never see, in the area above 10,000 rpm. Even the stock damper is not tuned for attinuation at this sort of rpm so the argument is somewhat of a moot point.

Now small engines that are pushing the limit with lots of revs, wimpy cranks, super long strokes, lots of boost and dwelling in the upper rpm ranges for long periods of time can benefit from a damper designed to deal with this sort of operation but our engine is not like this, and probably very few people with this motor on this forum push the envelope that hard. How many 1.5Liter, 400HP, 11,000RPM Yaris motors do we have on these forums?

As far as I can tell, our engine has a strong and stiff bottom end that is well built for our intended use. It has an internaly balanced crankshaft which is less like to break due to torsional vibration.

There are a lot of Nissan guys who use underdrive crank pulleys in road racing series like NASA or SCCA. Road racing is much more punishing on an engine than other motorsports. The engine is subjected to run times lasting 23 to 45 minutes with the engine always in the upper ranges of its rpm limit. One race weekend is the equivlent of hundreds of 1/4 mile passes.

NST sponsors the first ever wheel to wheel Scion tC NASA Road Race car. This car has been using underdrive pulleys from NST with great results since day one.

NST also sponsors two drift cars participating in the professional US drift series, Fromula Drift. Both of these cars have been using NST pulleys with no issues of any kind for the past few seasons.

We could go on and on...

Is a solid crank pulley harmless to all engines? No it is not. Small, super high reving engines, when modified way past the simple bolt on stages may have problems. These engines reach critcal harmonics, past the 10,000 rpm range, an rpm often reached by certain race engines.

A mildly modded inline six will most likely be fine but one subjected to high rpm for long periods of time (90% of its life) with lots of boost will probably suffer. In this case , the stock balancer/damper is probably not adequate either.

Some of the older american V8 engines are externaly balanced and it is critical not to use a solid hub pulley not designed for these applications, or damage to the engine could result.

Our engines and most around here do not fall into the above catagories. Rest assured that your engines will not blow up and die or have a reduced life in street and even racing use with these parts.

I would bet that every "expert" that tells you otherwise has little personal, practical, real world experience with the subject.

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Last edited by NonStopTuning; 05-17-2007 at 07:52 PM. Reason: spelling errors!
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Old 05-17-2007, 04:17 PM   #78
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Old 05-17-2007, 05:18 PM   #79
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Go Don!!! That is the road race tC we are involved in as well. :)
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Old 05-17-2007, 05:20 PM   #80
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Again with those ladies!!! I thought we told you not to tease us anymore.
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Old 05-17-2007, 05:35 PM   #81
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I've heard mention of a harmonic balancer when it comes to pulleys. Anyone care to enlighten me as to if the pulley needs one or not?
Yes I would like to be enlightened also
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Old 05-17-2007, 07:55 PM   #82
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Again with those ladies!!! I thought we told you not to tease us anymore.
Sorry about that sir, won't happen again!



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Old 05-18-2007, 12:39 AM   #83
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Great advertising, I'm hooked now. Will definitly be getting the pulleys do to the great reviews once I get my yaris.

When do you plan to release the rest of the pulleys?
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Old 05-18-2007, 02:11 AM   #84
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Sorry about that sir, won't happen again!



They can crank my pulley any time they want....
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Old 05-18-2007, 02:33 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by NonStopTuning View Post

I high suggest staying away from pulleys that are not anodized, as this is a very important part of the building process.
I prefer the look of anodized pulleys, but it has nothing to do with the "building" process, it's a finishing and largely cosmetic step.

**Step 1: RE-draw the stock pulley in CAD or Solid Works
Step 2: Machine out of solid block of 6061 Aluminum
Step 3: Put on car and test- If OK repeat 1,2 and go to 4
Step 4: Anodize so it looks pretty for a while!

Step 5: Sell the $hiT out of these because it is the best bang for the buck!!

**Note, this is MY patent RandD process...
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Old 05-18-2007, 12:07 PM   #86
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Great advertising, I'm hooked now. Will definitly be getting the pulleys do to the great reviews once I get my yaris.

When do you plan to release the rest of the pulleys?
Thanks for the kind words Shijima, we appreciate it.

We have a few other goodies in the works for the Yaris community, these should be out within the next couple months. The more you guys support us, the more we can do to support your community.

Stay tuned...
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Old 05-18-2007, 12:29 PM   #87
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Great advertising, I'm hooked now. Will definitly be getting the pulleys do to the great reviews once I get my yaris.

When do you plan to release the rest of the pulleys?
The best bit of advertising a company can do is to ship durable, high-quality products on time produced exactly to customer spec. NST does it and has been doing it for years... unlike the other guys, who can't even weld a proper exhaust.

You people defending you-know-who all over these forums spit in the face of two of our members who received shit products and shit service. I for one have more respect for our membership than to lend my support to an undeserving company.

They bought their way onto Scionlife and I'll be damned if they do the same here! If they want my respect, they can earn it. NST already has. Have yet to see one person buy an NST product and not be satisfied.
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Old 05-18-2007, 12:40 PM   #88
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Old 05-18-2007, 12:43 PM   #89
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Here you go fanboys, here is what you have to look forward to. Apparently you get what you pay for.

http://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=171397

Try to find that happening to an NST pulley. I dare you.
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Old 05-18-2007, 01:44 PM   #90
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