Why did the small car die back in the early '90s?

[BailOut]

I hear you, but...

Originally Posted by MudBug

maybe you missed the cargo area filled with real estate signs

Real estate signs fit neatly in the back of anything other than a trunk. Almost any hatchback or liftback will do.

Originally Posted by MudBug

or the weds night when it's filled with cheerleaders going for pizza with coach after practice

You can fit more people in a minivan than an Excursion.

Originally Posted by MudBug

or the saturdays when it's filled with camping gear for a boyscout day camp

Again a minivan, or even a crossover, would do just fine for this.


It is almost impossible to justify a large vehicle for 99% of the drivers on the road today. Very few of us can actually use a truck or SUV, many more can get by with mid-sized vehicles like minivans, station wagons, crossovers and light trucks, and the majority could get by with just a small, efficient car.

[MudBug]

Originally Posted by BailOut

It is almost impossible to justify a large vehicle for 99% of the drivers on the road today. Very few of us can actually use a truck or SUV, many more can get by with mid-sized vehicles like minivans, station wagons, crossovers and light trucks, and the majority could get by with just a small, efficient car.

Have you been paying attention, SUVs are getting smaller, and the midsized wagon things are taking over.

Aint Capitalism grand?

People used to drive cars, but they wanted something that could carry more stuff, they started buying the early SUV type vehicles buy wanted more luxury, so the SUV craze was born. Then they wanted better handling and found that they didn't need the 4x4 stuff so the SUVs got car suspensions and closer to the ground. Now they want better gas mileage and the sport wagon things are all the craze, Technology has caught up and it's not unreasonable to ask for a performance motor that gets good gas mileage, or a small car with lots of room and utility. I would have never considered a car like the Yaris until now, but it all caught up. A small car that gets good gas mileage, has lots of room for both people and stuff, and it doesn't overheat when I run the AC in AZ heat like the Yugo my GF owned in the 90's. Aint capitalism grand?!


Honestly, your blaming people for not buying stuff that they didn't know they needed and wasn't available even if they did know.

[Astroman]

I owned a '87 Chevy Astro van before my Yaris. Sure, it was a great hauler, seated up to 8, had a 27gal tank, could tow more than any other van in its class, but I never sat more than 6 people in it at one time. When I went over 75mph, I got 8mpg. At 55mph, I got 22mpg. It was a GREAT rig when I needed to haul things like furniture, my yamaha scooter, anything over 4ft long, etc. But more often, I drove it with just me, not hauling anything. Most of the time I owned the van it never had the seats in. My daily commute is 3.2 miles to work, times 4 (work, home for lunch, back to work, back home) and that was too much vehicle for just that. My girlfriend has a taurus wagon and it has a roof rack. Since I got rid of the van anytime we have needed to haul anything long, or say like a couch, we can either fit it with the seats down or strap it on top. And even though it gets maybe 16-24mpg, it is WAY better on gas than my van ever was. Sure, little cars are not the best rigs for towing, mud bogging, penis envy, seeing over the top of everyone else, hauling your entire extended family on a month long camping trip, but they are perfect for couples, singles, anyone who drives a lot in town, 3 people on a week long camping trip (I did it, you can too!). I commute a lot, about 1500-2500 miles each month. 99.5% of the year my yaris fits my needs. Getting to work, shopping, visiting family 2 hours away, trips to california, hauling around a few friends, my gas & insurance budget, the list goes on. I would love to have a old truck for hauling or towing, but not as a daily driver. My mom bought a '72 chevy C20 for just that. She wanted a old, 4x4 truck to be able to haul & tow. She puts about 2,000 miles a year on it hauling hay, wood, furniture, manure, gravel, dirt, trailer. It's her work truck. It's a tool. A small car is a tool that works for 4 or less people, grocery shopping, environmental impact, fuel economy, etc. Vehicles are tools, they are machines. If you live up in the mountains and you need a 4x4 in the winter so be it, you have to do what you have to do. If you have a 4-wheeler or snowmobile, need to haul manure or gravel so be it. If you need to haul a lot of people get a damn van, they do have them as well in front/rear/all/4 wheel drive. And believe me, there is more room inside a van than a SUV. My 2 cent rant.

[static808]

Originally Posted by Astroman

And believe me, there is more room inside a van than a SUV. My 2 cent rant.

nice post. its one of the big reasons why we got our van. we find it funny when kids being picked up at school have to pole vault into their moms' huge SUVs. i agree with mudbug that the utility purposes of large vehicles are very underappreciated, but i live in SoCal. i guarantee you that 95% of large vehicle (SUV, large Pick-up) owners out there DO NOT need the size of their vehicle. how much lumber is that 17 year old blonde going to carry from home to school in her chevy tahoe?? NONE. how much manure is that 25 year old stock broker going to transport from his work in century city to his condo in venice beach with that ford f-250?? NONE. when you look in the carppol lanes, what do you see here?? a shit load of civic hybrids and priuses with their carpool access stickers draped all over their bumpers and fenders. where are all of the SUVs and trucks?? stuck in traffic, since all of the drivers are riding by themselves, completely alone, carrying no cargo whatsoever. how do i know that?? yuppies in business suits, teenagers on cell phones, and metrosexuals fixing their hair using the rear view mirror DONT HAUL CRAP. but i totally give mad respect for the 5% of truck owners out there in SoCal that actually USE their vehicles. guess that's my rant for the day. sorry if i offended anyone, but if you're a single person who drives a big-ass vehicle and DOESNT need it, my apology doesnt apply to you...

--B

[eTiMaGo]

Back to the original topic, small cars had to get bigger because people wanted more space, more gadgets, more safety features, less noise... this means cars got bloated, bigger engines were needed, fuel consumption went down the drain... But if you think about it, there is some method to this madness, get two 80s lightweight hatchbacks in a head-on collision at 100mph, there won't be much left, modern hatchbacks will give you a better chance of surviving.

It's funny to see the evolution of those light cars, for example the Volkswagen Golf... The original one was a boxy, thin sheet metal affair, very lightweight, and in GTI form could get better acceleration that a latest model GTI with an engine that's maybe twice as powerful (not sure on the power figures, but look up the Top Gear video which is probably on Youtube).
Then what happens? The car company creates a newer, smaller car to take the place of the original.. Volkswagen Lugo, Peugeot 107 (and now the even smaller 1007), Toyota Aygo, etc etc

[Astroman]

I agree. Anyone who has ridden in a geo metro/suzuki swift knows on the highway those things feel like your going to die.

[static808]

to be fair to the little car, almost all classes of cars have gotten significantly better in terms of safety and efficiency since the 80s. but i agree that riding in cars like the metro and yugo were indeed very thrilling, since it did sometimes feel like near-death experiences! my favorite little car back then was my sister's daihatsu charade. 150,000 miles. was a weekend commuter car for going back and forth to Socal and AZ (she went to grad school there). what was the greatest part of that car?? she gave it only TWO oil changes for the life of the car! she would only top off the oil every few months. why did the car die?? it was burned in a garage fire! if not for the fire, she said the car still drove great and would have lasted MUCH longer. she was getting 50 mpg. THAT was a great car...

--B

[Yaris Revenge]

I agree that 80's small cars were scary. I think that advances in tech have now allowed us to vastly improve upon that.

That said, nothing chaps my ass more than an Escalade. That thing was designed by Satan himself. I don't mind it so much by the rapper crowd (it's understood, they have NO brains, and will buy anything that costs absurd $$$ just because it DOES), but the businessmen trying to look all macho...grrr.

~YR

[captainzerocool]

Originally Posted by ChinoCharles

Many older SUV's are no safer than the Yaris. They're too roll-happy.

You see SUV's on the roads en masse for the same reason Bush is in office. 52% of America is literally mentally insane.

I can understand having one in the garage for the family trip, but past that they're dumb. I can fit the groceries in the Yaris just fine... and a friend.

Your hilarious. Really....

It all boils down to image. Wagons were cool at one point then they died out in favor of minivans, who's death lead to "SUV's". Small cars like the Yaris may be next on that list.

[static808]

Originally Posted by captainzerocool

Wagons were cool at one point then they died out in favor of minivans, who's death lead to "SUV's". Small cars like the Yaris may be next on that list.

hahah...HEY! wagons, vans and hatchbacks will always be as cool as the other side of the pillow! if we're the only ones on the block with them, while everyone else has a SUV, doesnt that make us cool?? i always thought it was the less you were concerned about being cool, the cooler you actually were?? if thats the case, then all YW members are as cold as ice...

--B

[acrbill]

In this day and age of crumple zones and multiple airbags small cars are a lot safer than decades ago. Did anyone see that video of a Smart ForTwo hitting a concrete barrier at high speed? It bounced off and had no cabin intrusion at all. The doors still opened and shut. Its considerably easier to avoid an accident with my Yaris vs. my Expedition. In some respects a truck/SUV is safer, basically when someone hits you. Some of the turns I make in my Yaris on a daily basis would flip my truck over. Even something as simple as a tire blow out on the expressway might spell disaster for a tall SUV. My Yaris on the other hand had a totally flat RR tire that I noticed when I was getting out of the car. I very likely was driving on it for at least a mile and did not even notice it.

I personally like small cars, my wife on the other hand likes large SUV's. Its all a matter of personal opinion. In the past week I used loaded the Expedition with a load that would not have fit in an Explorer. It would have fit in a Grand Caravan but neither my wife or I have any desire to own a minivan. I always figured I would end up with a minivan until I used my sisters Odyssey to drive 10 hours straight. As soon as I got home I realized I could never own a minivan.

[louisq]

Originally Posted by deebrown

Interesting article on the MSN site talking about how fuel economy actually has gotten worse in the last 15 years as the cars have gotten bigger:

http://autos.msn.com/advice/article....tentid=4024682

The question I ask is - why did these cars get bigger in the first place?

My own hypothesis would be that the smallest of cars HAD to get bigger otherwise they were quite literally death traps on the highway if hit by a monster SUV (another reason how the SUV helped ruin the American car industry/environment)

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

++

Nineties hell....Saab had GREAT small cars in the fifties and sixties...My Saab '69 95 was a kick ass car. The 93 and earlier 2 stroke triples were screamers and kicked butt on the rest including the italians in road racing.

[wagoneer]

Originally Posted by MudBug

Sure


Post a picture of your small car with a quad in the back, pulling a boat 500 miles across the state to lake havasu or a trailer filled with camping gear 40 miles off the main roads into the middle of the desert, or filled with enough tile to do your kitchen and bathroom, or enough plywood, 2x4's, and roofing materials to build a shed.


Small cars good for people that live in huge cites, as a second car for commuting, or for kids. Anyone else is either stuck with it (Economy), batshit crazy (Eco freaks), or just plain crazy about small car tuning for performance. (probably the majority of the people here)

ummm. what he said.

[Typer73]

You should've see us driving down the highway with a 7-ft sofa tied to the top of our '73 VW beetle! Never found anything that wouldn't fit in or on that car.

[spkrman]

Originally Posted by BailOut

have never been loaded with anything heavier than a morbidly obese human or been used as a truck in any other way, shape or form.

LMAO

[spkrman]

Originally Posted by BailOut

It is almost impossible to justify a large vehicle for 99% of the drivers on the road today. Very few of us can actually use a truck or SUV, many more can get by with mid-sized vehicles like minivans, station wagons, crossovers and light trucks, and the majority could get by with just a small, efficient car.

This is very true.