In regards to understeer.......

[HTM Yaris]

I suggest getting your skill level WAAAAY up before driving a MR2 or Elise spirited . With these cars having the engine in the rear , it makes them susceptable to snap oversteer (especially in the wet ). The Elise is less susceptable than the MR2 due to the better tuned suspension , stickier tires and lower center of gravity . But even the mighty Elise will spin in the hands of someone who isn't up to par with their skills .

[jkuchta]

This car responds to very slight differances in tire pressures front to rear...

Just like Tomago and Loren said, play with that first.

I was able to dial out all of the understeer with completely stock suspension and no swaybar by running the rears like 3-4 psi higher than the fronts (34psi front, 38psi rear HOT). The car would pivot really nicely, and slight moments of oversteer were very controlable (i.e. a ton of FUN!).

I was running on 500 tread wear street tires, so the higher pressures were needed to keep the car off the sidewalls (though a trip to the Streets of Willow proved that there's really no way to keep a car that's driven hard off the sidewalls of a set of street tires, no matter how high the pressures are!)

The addition of a rear swaybar, better tires, and stiffer springs and shocks would have allowed more equal (and lower) tire pressures, as well as way more grip.


Tire pressures are one of those things you can play with a lot at the track, and it takes almost no time...yields almost instant feedback....and costs nothing...just don't change pressures more than 1-2 psi at a time.

[regal]

What about pure potential, I heard 1g. With my trd shock, tokico blues, and rear sway bar I'm just not seeing it. It tends to dive into oversteer. There must be more potential out of this car.

[Loren]

You can do anything you want with the suspension, if you don't put good tires on it, you're not going to pull a lot of G's.

[Tamago]

Originally Posted by regal

What about pure potential, I heard 1g. With my trd shock, tokico blues, and rear sway bar I'm just not seeing it. It tends to dive into oversteer. There must be more potential out of this car.

beating a dead horse here, but you bought crappy tires lol

[scape]

someone posted an article about achieving 1g or greater in some tests, and the only reason the yaris seemed to pull it off was very specialized, and probably expensive, track-only tires. the suspension mods they did (perhaps minimal but I believe it was coil-overs) acheived .86g from the stock .75 without the tire change.

[scape]

http://www.modified.com/news/0708_sc...hallenges.html
about 60% down the page, do a word search for yaris

[SailDesign]

Originally Posted by Tamago

beating a dead horse here, but you bought crappy tires lol

And you still haven't mentioned tire pressures - they are as important as susp. upgrades - really!
But that would be beating the dead horse again, so I'l shut up - none so deaf as those that won't listen....
(not you, Tamago, the OP)

[Tamago]

Originally Posted by Tamago

add camber in the front

play with tire pressures.

install rear swaybar

get a little toe-out in the rear

should fix all your issues :)

Originally Posted by Tamago

tire pressures. play with them.

Originally Posted by SailDesign

And you still haven't mentioned tire pressures - they are as important as susp. upgrades - really!
But that would be beating the dead horse again, so I'l shut up - none so deaf as those that won't listen....
(not you, Tamago, the OP)

tire pressures?

[scape]

perhaps he meant specific settings found useful?

[SailDesign]

Originally Posted by Tamago

tire pressures?

One day he'll get it. But I expect to have at least one more post deleted by then. Not complaining, coz it wasn't a particularly nice post, but I really hope he gets it soon.....

Off-topic, is there a way to find out which mod deleted the post, so that I can ask which part of it offended? would make recurring offensive posts less likely.

[Tamago]

Originally Posted by scape

perhaps he meant specific settings found useful?

more in the rear than the front ;)

where in S florida are you?

[scape]

near fort lauderdale, but not for long-- planning on moving to south carolina for a temp position

[Tamago]

Originally Posted by scape

near fort lauderdale, but not for long-- planning on moving to south carolina for a temp position

ah! i'm downtown ft laud!

interested in hub spacers with free installation?

[regal]

Originally Posted by Tamago

beating a dead horse here, but you bought crappy tires lol

They have never lost grip, what else does a tire do?

[cleong]

A grippier tire allows the car to enter the corner at a higher speed, maintain a higher cornering speed, and allows you to get onto the throttle sooner on the exit.

If your crap tires have never lost grip, then perhaps you aren't on the tire's limit yet.

[regal]

Its not a tire issue, when I toss into a turn the whole car's momemtum flies foward pushing me into the steering wheel, Its like the entire body of the car is pushed foward like being rearended. With my other cars Civic, Jetta, BMW, etc you enter a turn pushed back firmly in your seat.

[SailDesign]

Originally Posted by regal

Its not a tire issue, when I toss into a turn the whole car's momemtum flies foward pushing me into the steering wheel, Its like the entire body of the car is pushed foward like being rearended. With my other cars Civic, Jetta, BMW, etc you enter a turn pushed back firmly in your seat.

That sounds simply as though you are hitting the brake instead of the throttle pedal. Is there another way you can describe this that might help us understand.
Also, you ask about what else a tire does other than grip. The sidewalls are very important, and tire pressures play into the eway they behave in cornering - hence all the beating of dead horses about tire pressures. A flimsy sidwall (like most OEM tires) will be lovely and comfy, but distort under cornering, allowing the tire to "scrub" and produce understeer. Higher pressures help with those, but stiffer sidewalls on better tires do more.