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06-17-2012, 10:09 AM | #73 |
Takes corners too fast!
Drives: Absolute Red 2009 Yaris HB Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 830
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^ all these pick of them on other cars, I just want to see yours on yours and see a before and after dyno run. :D
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mods:15''Drag DR21 w/Nitto NeoGen 205/50R15, Tanabe DF210 lowering springs 1.6/1.8, TRD Rear Sway Bar, Tanabe Front Sway Bar, Micro Image Short Throw Shift Kit (both in and under), 8.64lbs flywheel, F1 Stage 4 Clutch, AEM Cold Air Intake (Red), Megan Racing Header, DC Sports Axle Back Exhaust, Micro Image Crank Pulley, NST lite Alternator Pulley, ARP Manifold Stud Kit,Tanabe Front Strut Tower Brace, ScanGuage II, Micro Image Silicone Radiator Hose Kit (Red), NRG Carbon Fiber Shift Knob (round), 2009-2011 Toyota Yaris Liftback Foglight kit, NRG Grounding Kit (Red), Hella Horns(Red),CF Hood |
06-17-2012, 10:30 AM | #74 |
2ZR swap. DO IT! Ask how!
Drives: 09 Meteoric Metallic HB Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: West Michigan
Posts: 2,333
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One other solution to the side-mount TB is to use a tapered plenum:
As far as runner length, all of the material that I have read insists that longer runners = low end power and vice versa. This is all based on the Helmholtz resonator theory. If you look at the first equation (relax, you don't have to solve it) you can see that the mass of air in the neck is in the denominator, meaning that larger masses of air (longer runners) will decrease the resonant frequency (RPMs). Increasing the cross sectional area will increase the frequency, as well as have a slowing effect on air flow velocity in the runners. The variables for the 'cavity' refer to the cylinder, not the plenum. tl;dr - science says long runner = low rpm boost. Unless this article has empirical evidence to back up their claims, treat it as snake oil. |
06-17-2012, 11:00 AM | #75 | |
play every day
Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,961
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Quote:
I'm certain that was simply an transposing error in the translation. The project was done in Jakarta, Indonesia. And whoever did it had extensive practical automotive experience. I'll bet it did not read that way in the original language. As to the intake manifold picture... just look at what you need to add to the manifold to try to overcome the inherent runner imbalances from taking fuel/air perpendicular to the axis of flow from the throttle body. In my opinion it's much easier to simply use a design with no imbalances that need to be overcome in the first place. Cars today no longer have the luxury of large empty underhood spaces in which to fit those complex wildly expanded designs. My old truck does... ...but those days are long gone. Last edited by tooter; 06-17-2012 at 11:21 AM. |
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06-17-2012, 11:11 AM | #76 | |
play every day
Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,961
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Quote:
This is a process that needs to run its course, and I'm taking each step carefully and deliberately so that I don't have to backtrack. Backtracking triples the cost of any project because of you're adding two more cost layers of undoing and redoing. It's already expensive enough just doing it once! |
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06-17-2012, 11:46 AM | #77 |
play every day
Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,961
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In 1987, Oldsmobile introduced a DOHC 4 valve "Quad 4" engine. It used an unequal length intake manifold with no plenum...
Later years changed to a log type manifold likely because it worked better. |
06-17-2012, 12:07 PM | #78 | |
ULTIMATE
Drives: 07 Yaris Turbo Join Date: May 2007
Location: Canoga Park, CA
Posts: 14,859
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Quote:
Giving up on an idea is a total loss though, I do know that one! For example, if the intake manifold causes a loss in power, I wouldn't bring it to market.
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Micro Image forums, online store and shop are now closed. It was a great eight year run, but it was time to focus on other things. I'm still selling parts on eBay under micro*image seller ID and customers can still make requests for anything specific. |
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06-17-2012, 12:09 PM | #79 |
play every day
Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,961
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A nice Corolla engine. Hope mine looks half as nice...
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06-17-2012, 12:26 PM | #80 | |
play every day
Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,961
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Quote:
You're right. That was a little hyperbolic just for a manifold. I work in construction where the triple rule is more of a reality. By the way how are your manifolds progressing? I just started and I'm a totally inexperienced amateur, so you had better not let me get a manifold on my car before you get one on yours. But I bet yours will work better than my junkyard special... |
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06-17-2012, 01:27 PM | #81 |
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Drives: 07 Yaris Turbo Join Date: May 2007
Location: Canoga Park, CA
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I'm pretty sure you'll have yours on first!
We have a prototype now that doesn't hit anything. It's tack-welded though, so it can't be installed on a car. Next revision will be a proto we can put on a car and see what happens. Maybe another week or two? I wish I could focus on this the way you're focusing on this.
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Micro Image forums, online store and shop are now closed. It was a great eight year run, but it was time to focus on other things. I'm still selling parts on eBay under micro*image seller ID and customers can still make requests for anything specific. |
06-17-2012, 02:55 PM | #82 |
play every day
Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,961
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This project is just a hobby to play around with in my spare time. But I've been interested in intake and exhaust designs and how they flow for most of my life, so the opportunity to do this is a dream come true.
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06-17-2012, 06:54 PM | #83 |
2ZR swap. DO IT! Ask how!
Drives: 09 Meteoric Metallic HB Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: West Michigan
Posts: 2,333
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OK, I've tinkered around with the suggested dimensions you gave me and it doesn't really look right. If you have access to a laser printer with high dimensional fidelity (and 11x17 paper) you could print these off and compare them to the original. I can't find the thermal gasket in the MI store--was it a special order item?
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06-17-2012, 06:54 PM | #84 |
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Drives: 07 Yaris Turbo Join Date: May 2007
Location: Canoga Park, CA
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^ Haven't put them up yet in stock though!
[edit] uploaded into the store now Yaris > Engine > Mechanicals
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Micro Image forums, online store and shop are now closed. It was a great eight year run, but it was time to focus on other things. I'm still selling parts on eBay under micro*image seller ID and customers can still make requests for anything specific. Last edited by cali yaris; 06-17-2012 at 07:33 PM. |
06-17-2012, 07:36 PM | #85 |
play every day
Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,961
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Hey Cranky,
Sorry my measurements weren't so good... and I'm presently at a disadvantage as everything is down at the machine shop because they are generating the working drawings. My own less-than-machinist accuracy is one reason why I simply got both the thermal gasket and a stock manifold. They completely remove all the guesswork, as there is an actual physical representation of everything required to make the adaptor flange fit properly. Hey wait, I think I see why the measurements aren't working out with your drawing! None of the Corolla manifold runners are concentric with the Yaris head intake ports. Your part as drawn indicates that they are. First, the Corolla runners are a lot larger, and second they more spread out. Consider just the two inner Corolla runners first: The two inner edges of the Corolla runners perfectly line up with the inside edges of the two inner Yaris intake ports. The distance between the two corolla runners and the distance between the two Yaris intake ports are exactly the same. That distance is the only one that matches exactly. All of the other measurements are different. Even the bolt holes bear no symmetrical relationship to the Corolla runners. Now consider the two outer Corolla runners. Both of their inner edges are 5mm outside of the outer edge of the Yaris runners. This is one reason why I'm specifying the flange be one inch thick, so that there will be sufficient distance to make a smooth flowing transition between the two different arrays of holes. Just email or call Garm and he'll sell you the thermal gasket. It's made by Golden Eagle. It'll make your task so much easier! I'm going to use it on my car. And you can make good use of it on yours. The intake manifold flange is really thick aluminium and will pick up conductive heat from the head. The thermal gasket will insulate it and keep it cooler. Last edited by tooter; 06-17-2012 at 07:54 PM. |
06-17-2012, 07:51 PM | #86 |
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Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
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Thanks, Garm.
It's an especially useful part because it not only pins down all the measurements exactly, it will get put into use when I install the manifold. |
06-17-2012, 07:59 PM | #87 |
2ZR swap. DO IT! Ask how!
Drives: 09 Meteoric Metallic HB Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: West Michigan
Posts: 2,333
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Oh, I had intended to cut the runners from the plenum for my design, so I made them concentric. If you look carefully, the runners holes are proportionately wider than the intake holes. I had considered what you were planning, but decided it was too much of a stretch and would make machining it a nightmare.
The 1NZ has 83mm bore spacing and the intake has (iirc) 87.5mm spacing. I had that written down somewhere... |
06-17-2012, 08:27 PM | #88 | ||||
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Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,961
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Quote:
I didn't know that you were going to cut apart the manifold runners. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Last edited by tooter; 06-17-2012 at 08:38 PM. |
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06-17-2012, 09:01 PM | #89 | |
2ZR swap. DO IT! Ask how!
Drives: 09 Meteoric Metallic HB Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: West Michigan
Posts: 2,333
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Quote:
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06-17-2012, 10:03 PM | #90 | |||
play every day
Drives: 2012 Yaris L 2dr 5sp Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 1,961
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Last edited by tooter; 06-17-2012 at 11:15 PM. |
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