Big 3 Upgrade: Planning Stage (Input Encouraged)

[The Architect]

Also, Is the factory Alt to batt wiring a straight shot through the loom to the battery? If so Im going to just cut the connector off the stock wiring and crimp it back on to a new run of 4 gauge back to the OEM batt. loaction and call it a day.

[Slick]

Ok, so I watched my SGII today. In park, no load, it runs at 13.6 to 13.7 staying mostly in 13.7. In drive, holding break, it runs at 13.5 to 13.6, swapping between the two fairly fifty fifty. I applied my largest potential load, in Park, and it ran 13.3, dipping occasionally to 13.2 but only on really hard notes.

BTW, correction to my last post, between 65 & 70 the SGII shows almost a constant 14.0 volts. Occasionally dipping to 13.9 but only a few times. It also showed 14.1 a few times but not enough to be considered a constant charging voltage.

Hope this helps

[talnlnky]

this actually doesn't surprise me.... You now have a more stable voltage... though it is slightly lower (than the max voltage on the oem alt)... stable voltage is much better, you may feel bummed...due to the lower voltage... but you should be happy.... that alt will last much longer than the oem would've.

[The Architect]

well i just got my volt meter in, ill be installing it asap and monitoring voltage throughout all scenarios and reporting back in a day or so

[The Architect]

sigh...

well idk whats to be expected from a HO alt because Ive never owned one but here's how things are as of today after many observations, tests and metering.

If I put on a truly low deep and bass heavy song a crank it loud BUT still clear the voltage will plummit to 12.75-12.85 a.k. the battery

....that fkn sucks even if it is only for a split second I dont want to be tapping the battery.

I didnt think my little 1000rms amp would be able to make this "badass" alt surrender but i guess so.

I talked to iraggi and he thought maybe the belt was slipping for a second on the hits but i seriously doubt it...but he knows more so im going to pick up a brand new stock belt and swap it.

If that doesnt alleviate the problem (dont think it will) then idk what his solution will be.

Since the alt does seem to be performing better than stock maybe ill just have him give me a 180A stock casing alt instead and refund the difference.

I'll stay hopeful though.

Should a 300A alt at 80MPH be able to sustain consistent voltage during deep bass hits at high volumes?

I mean my amp has an 80amp internal fuse so that means it wont pull more than 80 or so amps...right? He says no and its pulling more than that for sure...


so idk, feel free to comment

[goku87]

Man that sucks. Here's the best way you can test it:

Take it to a local place that rebuilds alts. Some hole-in-the-wall place, because they usually test them for free. They have machines they stick them on and turn them and check the output. Some places can print out the test results and they look kinda like dyno sheets, except for alts.

That way you can be like, "Okay, listen here, this shit don't work as advertised."

Ex:

[The Architect]

from those graphs it seems some alts dont put out until wayyy up on the rpm line where its not even normal

[sqcomp]

Hmmm...

Very interesting.

Here's what I think I'll do. I'll buy a Powerbastards 220 Ampere unit. I'll get it with an overdrive pulley and we'll see what happens. We'll install it in the shop and do the tests there simply because we've got the equipment to test it as well as keep a charge if anything should happen.

We'll see if this company's claims of 1200 RPM full output to 220 amperes are even near to being close.

I'm bummed that this Iraggi alternator didn't work as advertised.

[goku87]

Yeah, this whole situation is a clusterfuck. Everyone claims they have the best HO alt, but none can deliver.

Has anyone considered doing a multi-alt setup? I know our engine bay is small, but I've seem some creative things before.

[sqcomp]

I'm seeing the same. Like Goku mentioned, if one of us put together a dual alternator setup, with one isolated for the use of the sound system...

[talnlnky]

Originally Posted by sqcomp

I'm seeing the same. Like Goku mentioned, if one of us put together a dual alternator setup, with one isolated for the use of the sound system...

if somebody had the means to fabricate custom brackets that would probably be the best & cheapest way as you can often go to junkyards and find alts for under $20... I remember a few years back in Spokane,WA there was a junkyard that would sell you alts for $8... tho you had to remove it yourself.

The yaris/echo has been out long enough to have a few cars in the junkyard by now. Tho... if I was going to do custom bracket... I'd be tempted to just pull one from a truck that had like a 100-140amp alt.

one drawback to dual alts would be more load on the engine than a single alt, thus lower mpg's... prolly less than 1mpg difference tho.


EDIT:
Architect
I'm starting to wonder if there is something weird with your car... you dropped cable a while back and then said your voltage was funny after that.... Did you have your battery tested.... maybe you have a bad cell in your battery that is causing a wierd issue.... constantly trying to charge thus sucking amperage, thus lowering voltage... i dunno... be worth checking out tho.

[The Architect]

Originally Posted by talnlnky

if somebody had the means to fabricate custom brackets that would probably be the best & cheapest way as you can often go to junkyards and find alts for under $20... I remember a few years back in Spokane,WA there was a junkyard that would sell you alts for $8... tho you had to remove it yourself.

The yaris/echo has been out long enough to have a few cars in the junkyard by now. Tho... if I was going to do custom bracket... I'd be tempted to just pull one from a truck that had like a 100-140amp alt.

one drawback to dual alts would be more load on the engine than a single alt, thus lower mpg's... prolly less than 1mpg difference tho.


EDIT: r
Architect
I'm starting to wonder if there is something weird with your car... you dropped cable a while back and then said your voltage was funny after that.... Did you have your battery tested.... maybe you have a bad cell in your battery that is causing a wierd issue.... constantly trying to charge thus sucking amperage, thus lowering voltage... i dunno... be worth checking out tho.

Yea when i did that I essentially grounded the stock alternator which mustve messed up some of the internals causing it to charge poorly.

My yellow top sits at 12.75 cold and the alt charges normally.

Ill just take my battery to autozone for a battery test but a hot test would be misleading so idk

[The Architect]

so im starting to think theres something to this whole "belt slippage" thing.

on the way home from work i was only going maybe 40MPH and the multi/clamp meter was reading about 14 volts.

I then turned on lil johns "push that n***a push that h*e" for those that might like that sorta thing and then ramped it up to 48 on my HU which is pretty damn loud and the voltage was falling to maybe 13.7-13.8 which is fine. For just a second though it fell to the 12's so im being the optimist.

I just ordered a new dayco serp belt that "exceeds oe spec" and ill be giving that a shot and tightening the living hell out of the thing when i put it on.

[talnlnky]

belt slippage is a real issue...i've seen it before... When a big bass hit happens, large voltage dip causes the alt to engage and try to make a lot of power.... which means it puts a large load on the belt... if the belt is loose, even the slightest bit it may slip.

Saw this in a durango with six 15's and a 2200rms amp. Every time he cranked it we'd hear a squeal for a few seconds.... finally took a look at the belt and it needed tightening.

your alt can do what.... 280, 300 amps... that alt is very capable of putting a big load on that belt. I would think the belt would have to be even tighter than stock to ensure the belt didn't slip.

[The Architect]

Originally Posted by talnlnky

belt slippage is a real issue...i've seen it before... When a big bass hit happens, large voltage dip causes the alt to engage and try to make a lot of power.... which means it puts a large load on the belt... if the belt is loose, even the slightest bit it may slip.

Saw this in a durango with six 15's and a 2200rms amp. Every time he cranked it we'd hear a squeal for a few seconds.... finally took a look at the belt and it needed tightening.

your alt can do what.... 280, 300 amps... that alt is very capable of putting a big load on that belt. I would think the belt would have to be even tighter than stock to ensure the belt didn't slip.

The only time i ever hear a belt squeal is when i first turn on the car, other than that i cant hear or notice it at all during hits or anything and ive been outside the car for them.

as soon as the new belt comes in ill allot some time to swap it and ill make sure to have someone very strong with so as to get a really fkn tight belt.

is over tightening something to worry about because im not sure what threshold to restrain to.

[talnlnky]

i really don't know if you can have a belt too tight....

for reference... i've never heard my belt squeal. I also only have a 150 watt amp in my car.... and have never ran my battery low. I want this stock battery to last me 5-6 years.... I'm a cheap bastage.

[The Architect]

well this morning when i started my car and started monitoring voltage a saw a drastic difference in behavior from my electrical system.

for one the voltage hung around 14.45-14.5 for about 3 minutes or so before calming down to 14.3-14.4 and then finally stayin at 14.35/6 which is....very nice and unexpected.

The voltage seems very stable also (with the occasional hiccup) even with loud music and at idle in Drive it stays around 13.6-13.8 and in P or N its around 13.9-14.1

I dont know what to attribute it to but im about to go redo as much of my engine wiring as i can for preventative maintenance before it gets dark.

[talnlnky]

Originally Posted by The Architect

well this morning when i started my car and started monitoring voltage a saw a drastic difference in behavior from my electrical system.

for one the voltage hung around 14.45-14.5 for about 3 minutes or so before calming down to 14.3-14.4 and then finally stayin at 14.35/6 which is....very nice and unexpected.

The voltage seems very stable also (with the occasional hiccup) even with loud music and at idle in Drive it stays around 13.6-13.8 and in P or N its around 13.9-14.1

I dont know what to attribute it to but im about to go redo as much of my engine wiring as i can for preventative maintenance before it gets dark.

hmmmm....