Need some input...sway bars

[Terrorize]

Hmm....i've been looking for something that fits my Yaris sedan...

i noticed Dezod has PROGRESS ones...never heard of this company before...looked up their site...and it doesn't tell me much...
Anyone have any experience with this company? It's American right? Or are there 2 companies?

I'm kinda wanting Tanabe to get something out...but seems its not listed on the site as out or coming soon...

Thanks

[Yaris Revenge]

I read earlier somewhere that unless you plan on hitting the track, you won't notice the bar is even there, so kind of a waste of money (unless you ARE tracking).

~YR

[MrJester]

Depending on how you drive you will notice it.I notice mine every day coming on and off the interstate and a few of the sharper turns on have on my way to and from work. It is a get addition to this car.

[woof]

Check out this thread detailing my experience. I have the TRD bar and even if the Progress bar is stiffer it still may not be a significant difference between the two. The stock Yaris hatch is too tall and softly sprung for "act'in a fool".

http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4582

[turboyaris]

A rear sway bar is not really needed. You may notice some benefits like they said on the track. People accuse toyota of going cheap and not even installing a rear sway bar, sure they went with a cheaper design in using a torsion bar setup instead of an independant but in essence the torsion bar itself acts as a sway bar. the only benefit you would see in a sway bar is that it connects to the top of the springs in essence stiffing the effect of the torsion bar kinda acting as a brace. Thats my understanding of it anyways. That is the reason you dont see sway bars on torsion bar setups.

[woof]

Turbo, Toyota didn't put a rear sway on the Yarii because they handled well enough without them. That's published in a magazine or two. A rear sway further refines the handling and makes it more precise feeling in turns and lane changes. There is almost no difference in the ride which is normal.

If you put a rear sway on a front driver and can't tell any difference you're dead. You have no functioning senses. The effect on my hatch is more than subtle but not dramatic. It doesn't take long to forget it's even there.

I thinks all fwd's ought to have proper rear sways in the first place. Buuuut, most people don't salivate coming up fast on a curve but those of us here.

[Terrorize]

Thanks for all the replys guys...
Hmm...if that's the case i might be needed it....i love speeding up those freeway ramps and also doing fast sharp turns heh heh
Turns out Progess doesn't have the bars yet...i just msg'ed the guys at Dezod...

[Terrorize]

Also...i got a sedan...so maybe it will be more noticeable once its installed..?

[turboyaris]

I'm not arguing that you don't notice some benefits woof. I'm merely saying the differences between a torsion bar style suspension and a macpherson strut style with independant rear suspension. In the latter, (which is more common) the body is able to roll due to a large amount of weigh transfer. The sway bar acts as an equalizer in the shift of weight keeping your body upright. That being said with a torsion bar system (like we have) the torsion bar itself equalizes the majority of the forces. You regularly see torsion bar suspension in the rear on light less expensive vehicles, reason being is the weight transfer in the rear is minimal, something a torsion bar could take care of. so yes your right toyota didn't need a rear sway bar because it handled well enough with a torsion bar suspension. I'm just trying to let everyone know the differences in the suspension types.
If you look at japanese race cars and well built street cars they actually run stock sway systems and run an aggresive coilover. reason being is that you will see the biggest benefit from a good set of coilovers more so then you could ever see from a sway bar. If you really want to know more about this read the book... i believe it is simply entitled "race car geometry" they go into all kinds of detail on the benefits of suspension geometry.

[churp]

Turboyaris is right on springs (torsion/coil/coilovers) control the wheel movement up and down independantly (torsion bar springs do not act as swaybars). Sway bars connect the wheels side to side to prevent side tilt of the body...say if your left wheel is being forced upwards into the wheelwell the sway bar tries to force the right wheel up, trying to keep the car level, not allowing tilt. In effect for street driving with soft springs it helps keep the car level yet with good ride. With his mention of the Japanese race cars with coilovers I assume the higher spring rates must be enough for them, that they don't worry as much about sway bars?.......don't know myself, not a racer....just wanted to point out the different functions of springs and swaybars!

[turboyaris]

the torsion bar is actually the bar running across to the two rear wheels, and since the two wheels are connected by this torsion bar then it acts in the same way as a sway bar would. I forget the exact reasoning I read somewhere about why japanese tuners generally keep the stock sway bar, but I believe it had somehting to do with a too stiff sway bar actually lifting the inner wheel off the ground under extreme cornering loads. and they were against this. That is why in japan coilovers always come with a higher spring rate then here in the states. They would rather have performance then a cushy ride.

[brickhardmeat]

I say if you have the cash and the time put every suspension component you can afford to put on this car and make it as stiff as you possibly can racing or not. A nice stiff ride never hurt anybody. That is what I plan to do.

[churp]

A torsion bar spring is connected/constrained by the frame, thus it is a spring for each individual wheel. The sway bar is simillar but is not constrained from rotating in relation to the body/frame, it is only constrained from rotating by the other wheel. Two completely different animals!

Most production cars don't (getting old, more have them nowadays) have swaybars...they all haves springs of one form or another.

[ChinoCharles]

Terrorize,

In looking at your garage, I noticed you don't yet have upgraded shocks. For that reason, I would say buying a sway bar or any other suspension periphery is a total waste of money. Why? Because no money is better spent on a suspension than the two biggies, shocks and springs.

Coilovers are the ideal suspension setup. They provide for adjustment both in height and ride quality so you can really dive into turns at the track without having to ride in a roller skate from point A to B. Short of that, a set of sport shocks and lowering springs will also provide ample performance for most. I ride on the TRD suspension myself and I am content for now. You could strap all the strut bars, sway bars and braces you want on your ride and I promise you you will not keep up with me and my sporty shocks and springs in the turns. In short, shocks and springs are necessary... the rest is optional.

Having said that, I am going to preach something one more time. Running around blindly strapping every aftermarket brace offering onto your ride is not only stupid, but it can actually make your car handle worse. For example, I know for a fact that with the TRD suspension the Yaris still experiences a bit of oversteer. In other words, cornering at high loads tends to break the rear tires loose. If you aren't careful you will lose control and spin out. Now, as you increase the diameter of a rear sway bar it will effectively increase oversteer. In order to decrease oversteer you want to beef up the front sway bar and make the rear sway bar smaller. As the Yaris has no rear sway bar, if I were to buy a rear sway bar for this car it would only serve logic to think that this would increase oversteer on my car and make it handle WORSE!

In short, for anyone looking to actually improve their suspension, start with the basics... shocks and springs or coilovers depending on what your budget allows. Then go test what you have and find out what the car is doing. Only then can you do your homework and find the solutions in the aftermarket that are right for you. THE FACT A PART IS AVAILABLE IS NOT PROOF THAT IT WILL PROVIDE YOU WITH ANY BENEFIT.

[Terrorize]

Hey dude...thanks for the advice! Hmm...i don't really know too much about this car...i used to have a car that had the sway bars already stock...and it had pretty good handling already...so i just figured that this car didn't so maybe it would help if i had it...
i didn't really know the Yaris had the Torsion bar...and i've never put performance shocks on any of my cars before..so no idea what they do and what changes...which is why i never would of thought of those to upgrade...although i have thought of coilovers...but $1000+ is way too expensive of a mod for me...
Springs i already got...and i looked at the TRD shocks after reading your post...but it says for LB only?? Will it work with my sedan?? And any vendors here can get it cheaper than dealer or TRDsparks?
Oh...and the reason i put/want to puit all those braces on is because i can actually feel the chasis flex when i do some quick turns...maybe my sedan is slightly longer...and you can feel it more.
I'm just a daily driver that likes to have some fun and step on the gas once in awhile and take quick sharp turns once in awhile too...no tracking for me...
Thanks again

[Terrorize]

Thanks for all the info and advice guys! I'm a car NOOb....especially when it comes to upgrading Suspension and stuff...

[ChinoCharles]

Originally Posted by Terrorize

Hey dude...thanks for the advice! Hmm...i don't really know too much about this car...i used to have a car that had the sway bars already stock...and it had pretty good handling already...so i just figured that this car didn't so maybe it would help if i had it...
i didn't really know the Yaris had the Torsion bar...and i've never put performance shocks on any of my cars before..so no idea what they do and what changes...which is why i never would of thought of those to upgrade...although i have thought of coilovers...but $1000+ is way too expensive of a mod for me...
Springs i already got...and i looked at the TRD shocks after reading your post...but it says for LB only?? Will it work with my sedan?? And any vendors here can get it cheaper than dealer or TRDsparks?
Oh...and the reason i put/want to puit all those braces on is because i can actually feel the chasis flex when i do some quick turns...maybe my sedan is slightly longer...and you can feel it more.
I'm just a daily driver that likes to have some fun and step on the gas once in awhile and take quick sharp turns once in awhile too...no tracking for me...
Thanks again

The TRD shocks will work with the Sedan. As far as where you'll find the best pricing, I haven't seen anyone selling these lower than Sparks. I know it is a lot of money at $319, but your car will not feel the same. They're pretty impressive and a whole lot of fun.

Let us know how it goes Terror!

[Dezod]

Progress Competition is a USA based company in Anaheim, CA. They deal with a lot of race teams including one that both us and them are involved in (2007 Road Race tC)
Reference:
http://www.yarisworld.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3895

Anyway, smaller manufacturer, but great quality product. We are a WD for them, and have been for about 3 years now.