SS Brake Line + Brake Pad + Rotor Installed~

[Tamago]

Originally Posted by supmet

Also, with the stock rotors and pads I had problems with glazing the pads and warping the rotors. So far the R1 drilled and slotted rotors and carbotech pads have lasted longer than stock ever did, and they still look pretty much new.

warping the rotors will relate directly back to poor braking habits.

[supmet]

Originally Posted by Loren

The holes in brake rotors have NOTHING to do with surface area. They don't have anything to do with cooling, either. Their original purpose was to give the gasses produced by old-school brake pads (that haven't been used in over 40 years) someplace to go. Now, they're almost entirely there because folks think they look cool. They do add a bit of lightness, that's about their only true benefit.

I'm not talking about pad to rotor surface area - that is actually decreased. The entire surface area of the rotor is increased, allowing air to touch more hot metal, taking more heat. It also allows cooling of the center of the rotor, where an undrilled rotor only cools the outsides.

Originally Posted by Loren

More mass in a brake rotor allows them to absorb more heat over a longer period of time.

There you go. More mass = bigger thermal sink. It can absorb heat over a longer period of time, and dissipate that heat over a longer period of time as well, not faster.

Originally Posted by Loren

Holding up for a 2-minute autocross run? I never said ANY brake system wouldn't do that! I said "race track". I'm talking about lap after lap of braking from 90-50, from 70-30, from 80-40... over and over. I'm NOT making this up, I've seen cracked drilled brake rotors at race tracks on everything from Porsches and Audis to Mustangs.

Well I guess we can both agree that if someone is going to turn their yaris into a full blown race car, they should spend more than 100 dollars on rotors.

Originally Posted by Loren

Did you ever try just the Carbotech pads with the stock rotors? Hmmm?

Considering I had turned or replaced the stock rotors every 10,000 miles, and the R1 drilled and slotted rotors are roughly 1/2 the price of OEM, I didn't feel like gambling. I'm at 15k on the drilled with no problems.

Originally Posted by Tamago

warping the rotors will relate directly back to poor braking habits.

Or an automatic transmission and driving lots of hills. I constantly find myself choosing between overreving the transmission with limiting, or having no engine braking power and relying on my brakes for long steep hills. I choose a brake job over a new transmission. I'm sure if I lived in florida, your blanket statement would apply though. My corolla's brakes lasted three times as long with worse driving habits and driving in the same area. My current set up, if I had to estimate, looks like it will last somewhere between four and five times as long. So whether or not my braking habits are poor or not, these rotors seem to be holding up better.


edit: oh but the bling is totally why I bought them. All the people that pass within 3 feet and catch just the right angle looking through the little hole in my steelies drool in envy of my drilled goodness.

[HTM Yaris]

I have to agree with Supmet . D/S rotors do dissipate heat better . More air to more surface area = more cooling . Thats the whole theory behind vented rotors . As far as D/S rotors chewing up pads like cheese graters , false . For your rotors to be grated there would have to be a trailing edge that is raised . ( Go check your kitchen drawer ) . Carbotech pads will decrease the life of your rotors simply b/c they are harder and will grind away more material . Carbotech pads do take longer to heat up which in turn helps the seals in your calipers from melting and also helps to keep your brake fluid from boiling as quickly .

Cracks form from a combination of circumstances . The main one being from a manufacturing defect . When you cast anything , it is virtually impossible to obtain an even thickness throughout . Combine this defect with some heat and poor braking habits and viola ...a crack will raise its ugly head . If there is one crack ( from hole to hole ) that rotor is still usable but you would be wise to monitor for more cracks . I've seen many people do this ( On track ) . If a crack extends from hole to hole to hole , then you need to trash that rotor . If a crack extends from the outer hole to the outer edge then you will get a cheese grater effect from the warpage that will follow .

Speaking about on track , I have used the R-1 rotors on track ( against R-1's advice) and they work pretty darn good . The last time I went to Roebling Road . We did 100 + consecutive laps . The Yaris did come in the pits for driver changes but the car never shut off . We experienced no brake problems . Actually the Pros who drove my car said the brakes were surprisingly good . ( I'll get to my secret in a minute ) . We tried our darndest to find a flaw anywhere in the car . The only one we found was lack of power . But the R-1's did glaze up in the mountains . Which is why I bought new rotors from brake warehouse . The R-1's are still good but just wanted to try something else .

My brake setup is as follows : Toyota pads , Brake Warehouse rotors , SS lines and ATE Blue fluid . Check the pics below . On the car are the BW rotors . On the ground are the R-1 rotors . Check out the differences . The R-1's have bigger holes and slightly longer slots . The R-1's also have the hole closer to the outer edge . The BW rotors have 2 rows of holes between the slots . The BW have a powder coated hub/hat . The R-1's were zinc plated in its entirety . Both have pointed end slots .

The things I don't like about the R-1's are that they took longer to bed in b/c on the zinc plating and they glazed in the mountains ( after turning a pretty shade of blue ) . With a good bit of fade

What I like about the BW rotors is that there are more holes , albeit smaller than the R-1's , and the holes are not so close to the outer edge . I also like the powder coating on the hub/hat area . The rust doesn't "bleed" through like they do on the R-1's . I've gotten these rotors a nice crimson color in the mountains with no adverse affects Just a tiny bit of fade .

Now for my trick . Notice the R-1s . The one on the right is how everybody else installs their rotors . The holes are slanted towards the rear of the car . The one on the left are slanted towards the front of the car . My theory is that with the holes slanted forward it allows the outer edge to cool first after leaving the pad area thereby producing more consistent results after repeated use . The pros who have driven my car all say the can't believe how consistent my brakes are especially with stock pads . Then I point out my rotor orientation and they go "Hmm interesting" .

6 hours have elapsed since I started this reply to the time I posted . ( GF's Mini broke and I had to go and fix it , Tranny and flat tire ) So I probably missed a few replies .

[arcticvitz]

Originally Posted by HTM Yaris

I have to agree with Supmet . D/S rotors do dissipate heat better . More air to more surface area = more cooling . Thats the whole theory behind vented rotors . As far as D/S rotors chewing up pads like cheese graters , false . For your rotors to be grated there would have to be a trailing edge that is raised . ( Go check your kitchen drawer ) . Carbotech pads will decrease the life of your rotors simply b/c they are harder and will grind away more material . Carbotech pads do take longer to heat up which in turn helps the seals in your calipers from melting and also helps to keep your brake fluid from boiling as quickly .

Cracks form from a combination of circumstances . The main one being from a manufacturing defect . When you cast anything , it is virtually impossible to obtain an even thickness throughout . Combine this defect with some heat and poor braking habits and viola ...a crack will raise its ugly head . If there is one crack ( from hole to hole ) that rotor is still usable but you would be wise to monitor for more cracks . I've seen many people do this ( On track ) . If a crack extends from hole to hole to hole , then you need to trash that rotor . If a crack extends from the outer hole to the outer edge then you will get a cheese grater effect from the warpage that will follow .

Speaking about on track , I have used the R-1 rotors on track ( against R-1's advice) and they work pretty darn good . The last time I went to Roebling Road . We did 100 + consecutive laps . The Yaris did come in the pits for driver changes but the car never shut off . We experienced no brake problems . Actually the Pros who drove my car said the brakes were surprisingly good . ( I'll get to my secret in a minute ) . We tried our darndest to find a flaw anywhere in the car . The only one we found was lack of power . But the R-1's did glaze up in the mountains . Which is why I bought new rotors from brake warehouse . The R-1's are still good but just wanted to try something else .

My brake setup is as follows : Toyota pads , Brake Warehouse rotors , SS lines and ATE Blue fluid . Check the pics below . On the car are the BW rotors . On the ground are the R-1 rotors . Check out the differences . The R-1's have bigger holes and slightly longer slots . The R-1's also have the hole closer to the outer edge . The BW rotors have 2 rows of holes between the slots . The BW have a powder coated hub/hat . The R-1's were zinc plated in its entirety . Both have pointed end slots .

The things I don't like about the R-1's are that they took longer to bed in b/c on the zinc plating and they glazed in the mountains ( after turning a pretty shade of blue ) . With a good bit of fade

What I like about the BW rotors is that there are more holes , albeit smaller than the R-1's , and the holes are not so close to the outer edge . I also like the powder coating on the hub/hat area . The rust doesn't "bleed" through like they do on the R-1's . I've gotten these rotors a nice crimson color in the mountains with no adverse affects Just a tiny bit of fade .

Now for my trick . Notice the R-1s . The one on the right is how everybody else installs their rotors . The holes are slanted towards the rear of the car . The one on the left are slanted towards the front of the car . My theory is that with the holes slanted forward it allows the outer edge to cool first after leaving the pad area thereby producing more consistent results after repeated use . The pros who have driven my car all say the can't believe how consistent my brakes are especially with stock pads . Then I point out my rotor orientation and they go "Hmm interesting" .

6 hours have elapsed since I started this reply to the time I posted . ( GF's Mini broke and I had to go and fix it , Tranny and flat tire ) So I probably missed a few replies .

Nice write up! Seems like the people that track their cars have no problems while others choose to speak from what they've "heard".