Shifting (A/T)

[Spades]

Originally Posted by daq421

You know, I tried to be cool about your hostile and generally crappy attitude.. but thats over now.. You're not bringing anything to the discussion, only flatly stating your opinion as truth and when thats challanged getting all pissy. No one is yelling and hollering except you. So, feel free to leave all of us "assholes" trying to talk about this to it and find another thread to get all butt hurt over. Mmmmmm'k? thanks.
Oh and by the way, So you killed a A/T when you were 16.. I'm guessing that was no more than 5 years ago. Further you neglect to share what type of car it was, the condition, and whether you only down shifted into turns. All this tells me is a another teenager killed a car.. Whoopie, name me 2 teens that did not kill at least one car in some way or another as they learned to drive, thats why it's called "learning".

-Peter

wow dude. I am not getting pissy, I admitted that I was apperantly talking out of my ass.

I was 16, that was about 7 years ago, it was a brand new 3spd auto chevrolet cavalier. I downshifted into turns, and also used the 1-2-D method when accelerating. So yes, I did learn. I learned not to do that, and I tried sharing my personal experience here.

Spare me your high and mighty attitude about how I am the one that is hostile....your first reply to this thread you used the F word. I responded after several replies of yours that I was wrong, that you were right, and that if your transmission took a dump on you that I would laugh, and I will laugh if I see a post about your transmission slipping. So, admitting that you are right and I am wrong to you, is my butt hurting?

I offered my opinion to this debate and all you could do is say "that it has never happened to you" and then get hostile when I point out my reasons for thinking this is hard on transmissions.

Also, read that manual that was posted in PDF form, it says "Never put your foot on the accelorator pedal while shifting"...its the thing noted by the little caution sign...thats what I was refering to...I mean, you guys are the ones pointing stuff out in the manual, I was just reading what it said.

So, to recap, I am not pissy, I have shared with you the information about my car, I have not yelled or hollered yet, and you need to read the manuals that you post that are a attempt to prove me wrong. Mmmmmm'k? thanks.

[deebrown]

Is the yaris automatic transmission an "autostick"? Or am I completely way off?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autosti...with_Autostick

[daq421]

Originally Posted by Spades

wow dude. I am not getting pissy, I admitted that I was apperantly talking out of my ass.

I was 16, that was about 7 years ago, it was a brand new 3spd auto chevrolet cavalier. I downshifted into turns, and also used the 1-2-D method when accelerating. So yes, I did learn. I learned not to do that, and I tried sharing my personal experience here.

Spare me your high and mighty attitude about how I am the one that is hostile....your first reply to this thread you used the F word. I responded after several replies of yours that I was wrong, that you were right, and that if your transmission took a dump on you that I would laugh, and I will laugh if I see a post about your transmission slipping. So, admitting that you are right and I am wrong to you, is my butt hurting?

I offered my opinion to this debate and all you could do is say "that it has never happened to you" and then get hostile when I point out my reasons for thinking this is hard on transmissions.

Also, read that manual that was posted in PDF form, it says "Never put your foot on the accelorator pedal while shifting"...its the thing noted by the little caution sign...thats what I was refering to...I mean, you guys are the ones pointing stuff out in the manual, I was just reading what it said.

So, to recap, I am not pissy, I have shared with you the information about my car, I have not yelled or hollered yet, and you need to read the manuals that you post that are a attempt to prove me wrong. Mmmmmm'k? thanks.

You have confused me with at least two other posters.. I started the thread but I've not used the f-word, I did not post the Manual, and saying you'll be happy if one of our cars breaks down is just plain hostile. Further, if any of your responses were in any way really an acknowledgment of error.. well then I'm sorry.. But it sure does not read that way, I've read them a number of times and every single read through they come off as sarcastic at best.

-Peter

[Spades]

Originally Posted by daq421

You have confused me with at least two other posters.. I started the thread but I've not used the f-word, I did not post the Manual, and saying you'll be happy if one of our cars breaks down is just plain hostile. Further, if any of your responses were in any way really an acknowledgment of error.. well then I'm sorry.. But it sure does not read that way, I've read them a number of times and every single read through they come off as sarcastic at best.

-Peter

Apologetic, sarcastic, close enough. I don't know that I would be happy that someones car broke down, I just said I would laugh if your car broke down for reasons mentioned above after I was greeted by such criticism.

I apperantly don't know what I am talking about, we will leave it at that. So far no one has given me a explanation about how my theory(about the sun gear failing from stress that downshifting causes) is wrong. All I have heard are people saying that I am wrong...I was just hoping for a post that someone would actually tell me WHY I am wrong, other than "I did it for years with no problem".

I dunno, this is turning into a flamefest, so this is my last post. My intent was not to anger anyone, simply to explain what I belive to be true...not a opinion, just the facts that were given to me by transmission shops. My input is not welcome, so, I will leave you with what I posted and call it good.

P.S. you can tell you down shifted to far if the engine RPM's go through the roof and the engine starts shutting on and off really quick...sounds something like "Vroom...slam...vrooom....slam" you will hear it pop back and forth really fast and loose power, it can sometimes cause the car to shudder...thats the computer shutting off the fuel or ignition to keep the engine from spinning too fast...go rev limiter!

EDIT: and my responce prior to that was aimed at more than one person Dag, I should have typed out seperate responces, I was aiming it at all the flamers, not just you. I was not paying attention to who was flaming me so I just put up a general post to all the haters.

[St_G]

There's no need for the discussion to eb this heated. Does anyone have any outside (i.e., non-message board) voices on the subject.

These were the main two I could find:

http://www.startribune.com/131/story/163720.html

http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/030806.htm

Several other message board threads too, but I think we've got enough of those sorts of voices going already, though they seemed to fall more on the "not causing any harm unless you do something really stupid" and "almost impossible to do something really stupid, because of rev limiters" variety than anything else.

Other links (especially those dealing less with engine breaking and more with keeping revs up to pull through a corner) are welcome. Perhaps someone else can find more than I did.

[Pavel Olavich]

a Rev limiter is not going to help if one downshifts wrong...doing it wrong can hurt your engine over time without red lining the tack....it's fine if it is done right...done wrong over time can shorten the life of the tranny and perhaps the engine too, stressing many parts.

[Spades]

don't waste your breath...these guys may not know what the owners manual says about manually shifting a automatic(let off the gas any time you switch gears), or the inner workings of their transmission, or how it functions, but they are right, and you are wrong. I am just going to leave it at that.

I am still watching this thread hoping that someone can tell me why my explanation of what can happen (when you manually shift automatics frequently) is wrong though...so far I have just gotten hostility and "I have done it so it's ok"...maybe eventually someone that knows what they are talking about will either reafirm what I have said or blow me out of the water showing why my explanation was wrong and why I am stupid.

[PSU Yaris]

I downshift the auto tranny when i'm in a hurry, and approaching a redlight that might soon turn green. (i am either coasting, or braking when i downshift...sometimes, you dont even need the brake, due to engine braking). This way, when it does turn green, i'm already in the powerband, when its time to take off again. when i downshift, i make sure to the correct gear that corresponds with my speed, as to not redline. i think that as long as you dont downshift into the redline area (which i dont think the car will let you do), you'll be fine.

[earljail]

If you (not directed to anyone in particular) want to shift the car yourself, why not just buy a manual transmission? :)

*puts on flame hat*

[PSU Yaris]

Originally Posted by earljail

If you (not directed to anyone in particular) want to shift the car yourself, why not just buy a manual transmission? :)

*puts on flame hat*

because sometimes automatic is better when you're talking on the cell phone, or eating, or shaving, reading the paper, etc while driving.

[Spades]

Originally Posted by PSU Yaris

because sometimes automatic is better when you're talking on the cell phone, or eating, or shaving, reading the paper, etc while driving.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAH

[daq421]

Originally Posted by earljail

If you (not directed to anyone in particular) want to shift the car yourself, why not just buy a manual transmission? :)

*puts on flame hat*

Because sometimes we buy cars for reasons beyond our own desires.. The stick was my first choice, but...

1. I commute, a lot.. (auto is a far better tool for that application)
2. Availability, waiting for the stick (along with the body / option package I wanted) would have been a 4 (minimum) week wait.

Do I at times wish there'd been manual transmission available to me, yep.. But that was not the case.. So I make the best of it.
-Peter

[Black Yaris]

I am also baffled by those of you with auto's that want to shift them, it is just silly, and hurting your trans..... you are going to do what you are going to do.... I just don't understand why one would damage such am expensive part of your car on purpose, it is like not ever changing your oil

[yrsdrgn]

Originally Posted by Black Yaris

I am also baffled by those of you with auto's that want to shift them, it is just silly, and hurting your trans..... you are going to do what you are going to do.... I just don't understand why one would damage such am expensive part of your car on purpose, it is like not ever changing your oil

i only shove the stupid slushbox into 3rd gear when i go uphills and it's in low rpm in 4th gear. I also shove it into 3rd gear sometimes when going downhill. This wouldn't hurt my car badly would it?

[daq421]

Originally Posted by Black Yaris

I am also baffled by those of you with auto's that want to shift them, it is just silly, and hurting your trans..... you are going to do what you are going to do.... I just don't understand why one would damage such am expensive part of your car on purpose, it is like not ever changing your oil

Again.. This is not really a thread about using the A/T like a manual, It's a thread about dropping out of D and into 3rd entering into turns to bring up the RPM's to put power to the wheels when you need it. All I said was the little car seems to respond to this action very well (as opposed to say my old A/T Cutlass). Using the A/T in this fashion is much like using it to engine brake down a hill, or dropping out of O/D into 3rd to pass up a hill. I'm not starting in 1st and "up-shifting" as I pull away from lights, nor am I "down-shifting" as I come to a stop.

-Peter

[eTiMaGo]

You have to admit auto boxes have evolved by leaps and bounds over the years, now Lexus has an 8-speed box, and even on our lowly car, there's advanced electronics controlling the whole thing. "Manumatics" are just the natural evolution of the automatic transmission, since a computer unit can tell the gearbox when to shift, why not let the driver give some input too? All it costs is a few extra wires and buttons.

To be honest, there is some use to having a manumatic, it's a lot easier to change gears when needed (when going up a hill, or wanting maximum acceleration, etc), at the press of a button rather than the chance of moving the gearstick down an extra notch by accident. It doesn't make the shifting any faster, there'll always be a lag, and to be honest, the main reason for the whole system is that it looks good and makes people think they're driving a Ferrari or F1 car. And a car that makes its driver feel cool is a car that gets sold.

In a car of our class, auto boxes in any shape and size are not meant for serious sports driving, period. They're all about ease of use, so that pretty much anybody can drive without needing the foot-hand coordination to change gears. And like PSU Yaris said, it lets you concentrate on more important things when you take that boring commute... And what is the result of having a system anyone can drive? More cars are sold.

It does not mean you can't have some fun with it, though! One time, with a friend, we rented a cheapass auto car and put it through the paces, so to speak. Twisty hilly roads, large expanses of packed dirt, etc. I learned a lot from it. You can manually downshift and get the same kind of results as with a manual gearbox, but you gotta move the lever a lot earlier than you think you want to. You can control the whole thing to shift when you want to, how you want to, but your timing has to be completely different to a manual. It can be done, but it just feels weird... And it most likely does shorten the lifespan of the gearbox... What did we care? We were young and dumb and eager to learn, and it wasn't even our car anyway

The highlighted parts represent the way of thinking of the car companies, I think... Nowadays it doesn't really matter what is better, just what sells better. Sad but true.

[Yaris Revenge]

BIN-GO, eTiMaGo! That was exactly my point all along.

~YR

[eTiMaGo]

woohoo someone agrees with me *gets tears in his eyes*