tooter's manifold adventure...

[malibuguy]

the dyno looks like it would support an 8500-9000rpm screamer very well

[tooter]

Originally Posted by thebarber

Disappointing numbers...but at least you tried. For that, I applaud you.

And those are HONEST numbers, barber.

Both sets of runs done with a bone stock engine and a bone stock throttle body, just regular 87 octane pump gas with no additives, and no tuning. No dishonest tweaked numbers or tricky deceitful chilling down the intake before running. As much as I wanted the tooter to show an improvement, I won't cheat just to sell a manifold.

[cali yaris]

but I haven't yet been able to find any actual dyno run results

I know of one xB owner who dyno'd with that mani and lost hp, but I can't find the thread on SL any more.

Can't wait for the MI manifold! It's going to be ported for the 1ZZ TB, correct?

Yes, the proto came yesterday, and it is ported for the 1ZZ. I think there is a thread for that project, so I'll post comments over there. This epic thread belongs to tooter.

[packetrace]

will the 1nz tb fit ?

[cali yaris]

fitment is the same

[4/20 NEVER FORGET]

If the weapon-r manifold made the claimed amount of horsepower you know there would be dyno charts to support it. It doesn't, so there are none. I am surprised there are seriously nearly zero charts online. Some google image searches show some charts paired up with other mods, and none of those charts show large gains over what I/h/e are worth.

I'm excited to see this MicroImage manifold. If they are so close to a finished product there is no sense in building my own right now. My ideas from working on NA Hondas in the past was you could improve the plenum design of the weapon-r, as well as add velocity stacks to each intake port inside the manifold. Maybe the problem with the weapon-r is they were trying to find a balance between NA and FI performance?

[cali yaris]

Possible test install as soon as tomorrow.

[tooter]

Originally Posted by 4/20 NEVER FORGET

If the weapon-r manifold made the claimed amount of horsepower you know there would be dyno charts to support it. It doesn't, so there are none. I am surprised there are seriously nearly zero charts online. Some google image searches show some charts paired up with other mods, and none of those charts show large gains over what I/h/e are worth.

I also looked and found nothing definitive behind Weapon R's advertized 15 to 30 horsepower gain. But I'll bet that they might be able to get that with a combination of other mods.

The actual performance of an intake manifold can be muddied up with other concurrent mods like intake, throttle body, injectors, fuel, e tuning, or exhaust, so that you never actually know whether or not an increase was in the manifold. This is why I did the two sets of runs with the manifold as the only change, so that I would have an accurate assessment of it alone.

I'm excited to see this MicroImage manifold. If they are so close to a finished product there is no sense in building my own right now. My ideas from working on NA Hondas in the past was you could improve the plenum design of the weapon-r, as well as add velocity stacks to each intake port inside the manifold. Maybe the problem with the weapon-r is they were trying to find a balance between NA and FI performance?

It sure doesn't hurt to hold onto your $469 and wait to see what happens.

And that makes sense. From what I've read, forced induction plenums need to be larger than normally aspirated ones so that one plenum size cannot ideally fit both. But a single plenum size compromise between the two could work less than ideally for both.

[thebarber]

Originally Posted by malibuguy

the dyno looks like it would support an 8500-9000rpm screamer very well

I disagree. If you follow the tq curve linearly to 6500rpm and work out the HP you get 70wtq and about 85whp....

[CoryM]

Hats off to you Tooter. Always respect those who try new things.
I would suggest swapping that intake onto a modded/boosted engine at the dyno and seeing what happens.
Cheers.

[malibuguy]

Originally Posted by thebarber

I disagree. If you follow the tq curve linearly to 6500rpm and work out the HP you get 70wtq and about 85whp....

Probably with a stock motor sure...but a proper motor moving a shit of air and going higher rpms looks like it may benifit.

[tooter]

Originally Posted by malibuguy

Probably with a stock motor sure...but a proper motor moving a shit of air and going higher rpms looks like it may benifit.

The 1998 Corolla manifold was designed to flow for a 120 horsepower (at 5,700rpm) 1ZZ FE 1.8 engine that redlined at 6,000 rpm. Our 1NZ FE 1.5 is 20% smaller, so theoretically the manifold could flow past the stock redline if the engine was capable of it. Now if a 20% smaller engine could rev 20% faster, that would put the theoretical redline at 7,200.

I have no idea how a forced induction would work with this manifold. I only know that a guy from Puerto Rico did one. I'll see if I can find the thread with the pic of it...



This was my inspiration...

[ljming99]

And that makes sense. From what I've read, forced induction plenums need to be larger than normally aspirated ones so that one plenum size cannot ideally fit both. But a single plenum size compromise between the two could work less than ideally for both.

Thats why i said earlier as well, there is "no best of both worlds" ..more of a balance / compromise. The length of the intake was a very good example.

Same as power - you want to make power - you can forget about fuel economy

^^ btw i like the matt black stealth look :)

[cali yaris]

106 hp / 120 hp = 11.7% difference (more important than simple displacement)
1.5L / 1.8L = 16.7% difference

Where you getting 20%, tooter?

[tooter]

Originally Posted by ljming99

Thats why i said earlier as well, there is "no best of both worlds" ..more of a balance / compromise. The length of the intake was a very good example.

In efforts to bridge that compromise gap, engineers even went so far as to design dual length runner intake manifolds like this Ford Taurus SHO intake manifold for their Yamaha engine, which just has to be one of the most intriguing engines ever to be found in a Ford...



Coincidently, one of the CNC guys at Origin Design in Santa Monica worked on the design of this manifold.

Same as power - you want to make power - you can forget about fuel economy

That's been one of the unintended consequences of the tooter manifold. My gas mileage average has been consistently higher by about 1.5 mpg and I'm not really sure exactly why. One guess is the combination of its overall smaller volume and slightly longer runners.

^^ btw i like the matt black stealth look :)

How about this silver one?

[tooter]

Originally Posted by cali yaris

106 hp / 120 hp = 11.7% difference (more important than simple displacement)
1.5L / 1.8L = 16.7% difference

Where you getting 20%, tooter?

Should have said the 1ZZ FE was 20% larger than the 1NZ FE.

1.5 +20% of 1.5 = 1.8

Hey, so what's the news on your manifold? Did you run it yesterday?

[tooter]

Originally Posted by suckerface

4/20 is right, it's part number 22030-0D030 that I got. Personally, I completely bypassed the coolant lines.

Hit up eBay or a junk yard now and then. You'll probably be better off at the junk yard as on eBay they're all around $150.

Is it this one? It's only $119 and free shipping...



Do you know what the base gasket looks like? The reason I'm asking is to determine how to configure the adaptor, as I'm not sure if the larger bore will work with the stock 1NZ FE Oring gasket.

[Bluevitz-rs]

If you're going to do it, just get a new gasket from the dealer and base your template off that.